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public moderater logs
RE: public moderater logs 07-18-2014, 10:38 PM (This post was last modified: 07-18-2014 10:55 PM by verts.)
Post: #11
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I don't understand why you need access to warning logs, for what intent? There is no benefit of a regular member being able to see them. The warning system is obviously for warnings, no one else can see them, what is the point of you being able to see them? They do not effect you personally and you do not benefit from the information, therefore you should not see them.
If a thread is wrong report it, you don't need to see if you were right and that the user got a warning as a consequence, that seems naive and ignorant.
Your personal opinion on some mods and your own warning is not a valid reason to make all warning logs public, please contact Alan/Tarothin if you have any concerns about your warnings.
Also you are not being targeted by mods, like boomer said, we only briefly check the forums and look to make sure everything is correct, if you feel like a thread is wrong, then help us out and report that thread as we can easily miss something.

That is only the ethical side of things, now lets get to the technical side.
That would mean granting regular users the permission to see logs, and denying them other mod permissions. To do this would require a huge re-config of the forum, pretty much granting users pre-existing mod powers, which isn't a nice thing to do with.
The time and effort involved in making them public, would not bring any benefits to anyone. Why go through all that process because certain users are curious about other peoples warning logs, which is their private information. Now that is just ethically wrong.

In the real world, a criminal record brings benefits, eg. You can see someone is a criminal before you hire them.

ON this forum, seeing private warning logs, brings no benefits as you do not gain anything from the information, except that User A made a wrong thread.
Nothing personal, just my opinion.

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RE: public moderater logs 07-18-2014, 11:11 PM
Post: #12
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(07-18-2014 03:47 PM)Huntress13 Wrote:  I guess you don't have any right to say mods are being biased, seeing that you have no concrete evidence. If one mod is being biased to another because of personal relationship etc, don't you think another mod with no relationship with that person will issue a warning? That's why we have a team of mods, not only one mod.

Btw the rules aren't very clear. Ie if u post to sell a bordered 5* in the 5* non-ace section, you get a temporary warning. Quite a minor one. But its not stated explicitly in section rules that borders are not allowed. Yes it's colour coded to show which guardians shld be posted where, but it's not really clear and explicit enough. Some ppl, newbies to the forums esp, might think, 'oh, borders are non-ace 5*' and post their borders to sell, hence resulting in them getting a temporary warning Sad

Ah, sorry almost forgot to address your concern about the current Rules thread.

We have an all-new Trading Post system ready to be implemented which DOES have clearer rules about what belongs or doesn't belong in each section. We are just waiting for it to come out....

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RE: public moderater logs 07-18-2014, 11:36 PM
Post: #13
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(07-18-2014 11:11 PM)BoomerBaby Wrote:  We have an all-new Trading Post system ready to be implemented which DOES have clearer rules about what belongs or doesn't belong in each section. We are just waiting for it to come out....
It's been...7 months? Tongue

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RE: public moderater logs 07-18-2014, 11:43 PM
Post: #14
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(07-18-2014 11:36 PM)Subzero91 Wrote:  
(07-18-2014 11:11 PM)BoomerBaby Wrote:  We have an all-new Trading Post system ready to be implemented which DOES have clearer rules about what belongs or doesn't belong in each section. We are just waiting for it to come out....
It's been...7 months? Tongue

I know right?? I want to clean up that cesspool which is currently known as "iOS Stones/Feeders" already

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RE: public moderater logs 07-19-2014, 12:10 AM
Post: #15
Post 1. Warnings are given for rule violations. Rules that are not only stated in the COC but each section has it's own rules in the sticky section.
2. Warnings can only been seen by the user who has been warned and the mod team, which means that NO ONE on the forum other than yourself or someone with mod priveleges would even know that u have a warning.
3. Just like users have a user control panel( user CP), mods have a mod CP which grats us access to not just moderator logs, warnings logs but logs of every single activity every single member has done here. Basically IF is really want, I can see everything you have done until date. Except that we don't have interest in your personal work unless it violates any rules so we don't go checking besides it's impractical coz this forum has thousands of users.
4. If the warning system is itself set to private mode, why do u want the whole world to see the warning logs and know who's got what warning??? I don't see your problem at all. You have a problem with being given a temporary warning. Emphasis on "TEMPORARY". Once the duration is done, your warning goes back to 0 level. To top that, the warning can't even be seen by anyone else.
5. Understand that warnings aren't really a system meant for users. It's a system meant for mods to keep track of previous infractions. Sort of a rap sheet which only mods can see and the user himself. I don't think this much privacy is given even in real life.

In stead of asking us to answer your questions which are essentially lacking grounds, why don't you answer some questions first so we can cooperate with you better?

1. Why do u want to know what's happening with other users? Their warning info?
2. Why should your request which is actually against forum policy be changed because you're the only one who feels the need to violate privacy rights on this forum?
3. If you find some mod being biased or if you feel you're being picked on, why not contact a senior mod like tarothin, the rock or myself to address it to?

What you're asking for isn't a forum suggestion, it's more like a declassification of private activity not only of an individual but of the entire forum. The amount of issues that raises is inexpressible. Currently we have to answer questions of users asking about their own warnings. With your "suggestion" we will have to answer to people enquiring into other peoples warnings. Unless you're willing to give us a salary to do all this kind of work, I would recommend that you spend that much time and effort in reading the rules so that you can not only avoid getting warnings but also be able to ensure that you're not warned for unjust reasons.

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RE: public moderater logs 07-19-2014, 05:19 AM
Post: #16
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(07-19-2014 12:10 AM)Alan Wrote:  1. Why do u want to know what's happening with other users? Their warning info?
2. Why should your request which is actually against forum policy be changed because you're the only one who feels the need to violate privacy rights on this forum?
3. If you find some mod being biased or if you feel you're being picked on, why not contact a senior mod like tarothin, the rock or myself to address it to?

A log of warnings wouldn't be so much to see the warnings members had as it would be for warnings mods have given. IE you receive a warning hen you look up the mod that gave you the warning and it says he gave out 30 of same warnings to everyone else OK she/he is just a thread title name nazi no big deal. But if you look and see their is only 2 warnings given out and one was to you meanwhile there are 12 other of those violations floating around on the same thread then you can tell that the mod is being selective with the enforcing the rules.
With the warning system it relies on the interpretation of the rules and your post by a mod. Once I was given a warning then it was revoked 10min later by one mod only for me to get a pmed from a different mod saying I need to change my post or I would receive a warning for the same issue.
There is no system of checks and balances in place that normal members to see or use besides talking to another mod. If putting the warning records out in the open would violate why not have a complaint thread that is public just like the hacker/scammer thread?

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RE: public moderater logs 07-19-2014, 06:11 AM (This post was last modified: 07-19-2014 06:13 AM by verts.)
Post: #17
Post It's Alans job to check if us mods are performing our jobs and handing out correct warnings, he is the check and balance system, it is not your job as a regular user to make sure us MODERATORS are doing our job, thats absurd. We are not machines that are on 24/7 to catch voilations.

Simple solution, read the rules. You will have no worry about voilating anything.

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RE: public moderater logs 07-19-2014, 06:33 AM
Post: #18
Post The rule are interpreted differently from mod to mod

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RE: public moderater logs 07-19-2014, 06:36 AM (This post was last modified: 07-19-2014 06:41 AM by BoomerBaby.)
Post: #19
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(07-19-2014 05:19 AM)Itswillson Wrote:  A log of warnings wouldn't be so much to see the warnings members had as it would be for warnings mods have given.
Isn't that the same thing, though, basically?

Quote:IE you receive a warning hen you look up the mod that gave you the warning and it says he gave out 30 of same warnings to everyone else OK she/he is just a thread title name nazi no big deal.

I guarantee you every mod has dished out hundreds of "title violation" warnings as it is the rule broken the highest number of times by users on this forum.

Quote:But if you look and see their is only 2 warnings given out and one was to you meanwhile there are 12 other of those violations floating around on the same thread then you can tell that the mod is being selective with the enforcing the rules.

This is not really a good indicator of a mod being "selective in a non-professional way" (such as personal relationships). It could mean a variety of things including but not limited to:

-New threads being created as the Mod is going through the list or even seconds after the Mod goes offline. (Happens to me a lot, very frustrating)

-Mod only had 30 minutes to quickly check up on things so could only search through 1 or 2 pages worth of only ONE section. (Remember, we not only have to check Titles, but the entire CONTENTS of each post.)

-Mod issued one Warning, then had to deal with more urgent matters such as an Auction dispute, Scammer Report, Rep abuse, thread in general chat going crazy, RMT threads, Spambots, etc etc etc

Quote:With the warning system it relies on the interpretation of the rules and your post by a mod.

Yep, that's our job. If you have any questions about the rules, it's also our job to answer your questions. How can we answer/educate you, if you don't ask before posting? So what you are left with is a bunch of Warnings issued AFTER the fact.

Quote:Once I was given a warning then it was revoked 10min later by one mod only for me to get a pmed from a different mod saying I need to change my post or I would receive a warning for the same issue.
That just tells me that 2 Mods has the same thought that your thread was incorrect or misleading somehow. That's a perfect show of checks right there.

Quote:There is no system of checks and balances in place that normal members to see or use besides talking to another mod. If putting the warning records out in the open would violate why not have a complaint thread that is public just like the hacker/scammer thread?

Actually, Alan DID make a public announcement when we first got our new Mod siggies (maybe a month ago?) explaining all about the different Mod Teams and the main concerns of each one. jTeam (Judiciary Team) Alan/Tarothin/The Rock is who you should contact in the case of suspected favoritism/rule bending/taking advantage of Mod title/Mod Power Abuse/other unprofessional stuff by current Mods.

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RE: public moderater logs 07-19-2014, 10:59 AM (This post was last modified: 07-19-2014 11:01 AM by Alan.)
Post: #20
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(07-19-2014 05:19 AM)Itswillson Wrote:  
(07-19-2014 12:10 AM)Alan Wrote:  1. Why do u want to know what's happening with other users? Their warning info?
2. Why should your request which is actually against forum policy be changed because you're the only one who feels the need to violate privacy rights on this forum?
3. If you find some mod being biased or if you feel you're being picked on, why not contact a senior mod like tarothin, the rock or myself to address it to?

A log of warnings wouldn't be so much to see the warnings members had as it would be for warnings mods have given. IE you receive a warning hen you look up the mod that gave you the warning and it says he gave out 30 of same warnings to everyone else OK she/he is just a thread title name nazi no big deal. But if you look and see their is only 2 warnings given out and one was to you meanwhile there are 12 other of those violations floating around on the same thread then you can tell that the mod is being selective with the enforcing the rules.
With the warning system it relies on the interpretation of the rules and your post by a mod. Once I was given a warning then it was revoked 10min later by one mod only for me to get a pmed from a different mod saying I need to change my post or I would receive a warning for the same issue.
There is no system of checks and balances in place that normal members to see or use besides talking to another mod. If putting the warning records out in the open would violate why not have a complaint thread that is public just like the hacker/scammer thread?

Look we have a solution to your problem but it's not what you want. What you want isn't going to be possible for us. So the solution is for you to accept our proposed solution or keep I fractions forum rules only leading to further warnings and eventually ban. Hopefully it doesn't need to go that far and you'll be cooperative enough to allow this forum to run smoothly.

If u feel a mod is being biased, report it to taro think the rock or to me. We don't do trading post moderation. We have other responsibilities hence we can look into it without bias.
If u feel that you're being caught but others aren't then simply report those 10-12 floating threads immediately And the trade mods will get to work. You see once a report is made via a report button on the thread opening post, all mods online and who will login later will be notified and until that issue is resolved that notification won't vanish. Thus if u want mods to attend to you, just press the report buttons. Report with good reasons tho. If u feel one mod has warned you unfairly and you feel it deserves and inquiry, let the jTeam mods know. We can be identified from our signature logos.

We have rules here and the mods are the rule enforcers. While we are subject to the rules as well, we are subject to rules as users while enforcing rules are our moderation responsibilities. The two don't overlap.

Other users don't need to know who has what warning, like I've said before. Warning system is a rap sheet for mods to look at. Not other users. That's just not right and many people can find it alarming because they might feel it jeopardizes their response and credibility on the forum

Understand one thing, title violations are the most insignificant warnings we give. We are mostly interested in scam, hacks and other moderation work. We don't expect any user to get a title warning more than once or twice in their forum lifetime. As long as you've got the message intended, you needn't worry about title warnings if u follow the rules.

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